Qantas rule leaves toddler stranded

[Possum]

NZ LAW - 12 to be left home alone and 14 to be left home alone in charge of minors.

[sluggo]

I remember taking care of the neighbor kids when I was 12 for a whopping 25 cents an hour. Of course that was a very long time ago.

Who were you baby sitting ? Mary, Laura & Carrie Ingalls ?

Not quite that far back but they are probably today older than most on this board. And yes it was on the prairie.

[Morrolan]

yet a 14 year old boy is man enough to save a drowning 70 year old from cold water and keeping her afloat for nearly half an hour swimming against the flow...

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/s ... 09,00.html

[Pinklepurr]

It all just goes to show that people mature differently, there are some adults I wouldn't trust taking children down to the local shops and other teeenagers who I would trust implicitly.

The bit on the plane, well it wouldn't take much for her to have checked first, QANTAS are quite clear on their rules about minors and flying etc, virtually a whole page dedicated to it on their online booking site. It even states something about children under the age of 5 or 6 having to be accompanied by someone of immediate family over the age of 15 and not being sent as unaccompanied minors.

[Kooky]

So both Qantas and Virgin are in the news for not allowing men to sit next to unaccompanied minors. A couple of men have claimed it's discrimination, prompting a huge debate and possibly a change in the rules.

Interested in what the parents among us think of it?

(FTR I think the tabloids saying these two are a firefighter and a nurse and insinuating neither of these professions could harm a child is pathetic, very dangerous thinking.)

[Lili Von Shtupp]

I don't think I know a man who would actually want to sit next to a child on a plane.

[Pinklepurr]

You know I don't ever think I thought that much about who would be sitting next to them. We did it a lot with my family. Most times the children ended up with other unaccompanied minors (there always seemed to be a few of them on board). My stepson flew almost all his flights unaccompanied to visit us, never once in that time was he ever seated next to an adult.

[slinky]

I don't think I know a man who would actually want to sit next to a child on a plane.

Probably a fair point, Lili

Unaccompanied minors on planes seem to send the airline people into a panic, I think. When we went to the US in June, we arrived at Changi with 4 seats - 2 had been upgraded to Business Class (the ones with my and Mr. S's names attached to them) and 2 were in economy (the ones with the slinkies' names on them). Upon check in, the woman behind the counter started to panic when she realized the seats for the two 8 year olds were not with their parents and started making noises about unaccompanied minors. We quickly assured her that we, the parents, would split up and that neither 8 year old would be sitting unaccompanied today.

Honestly, I can't see sending my kids on a plane without being with them for quite a few more years yet. By the time they are around 14-15 years old, I suppose it could happen or be necessary for some reason, but at that point they should be quite capable of looking after themselves and getting on and off the plane, etc. without any great assistance. And even then, if one of us wouldn't be going with them, I would think it would be some sort of school related thing and there would be at least one adult chaperone on the plane as well.

[Fat Bob]

I used to catch a bus to school every day from when i was 11 years old. Ok, i know life is different now (30 years on) but surely if planes are a problem, so should buses and trains be a Problem.

Hell, all men have the right equipment to be a rapist and a paedo. But there again, all women have the right equipment to be a prostitute.

[Tas]

I'd be bummed out if I was asked to sit next to the kids.

I have some empathy with the policy, in their trying to manage risk. From customer service perspectice the handling at coal face of implementing was pretty disgusting, and don't blame these guys for feeling offended at all. Can you imagine minding your own business and then out of blue having people treat you like a pariah in front of all those other judging passengers, incredibly rude. The issue should have been managed long before anyone took their seat. That is plain incompetence.

[slinky]

I guess this just backs up my point that I won't want to be sending my kids as unaccompanied minors on a flight any time soon.

The couple claims the representative told Perry that United's unaccompanied minor personnel "forgot to show up" to help escort Phoebe through Chicago O'Hare to her connecting flight.

10 year old girl 'lost'

Edit: Of course, why they thought it was a good idea to send their 10 year old half way across the country with a connecting flight unaccompanied rather than take her to summer camp themselves does beg a few questions if you ask me. That's definitely a "You did what?!" type scenario as in: 'Yeah, we put her on the plane by herself to fly from California to Michigan and the airlines lost her for a bit' -- "You did what??!"

[baloo]

Dunno, I know plenty of people who have sent their kids of unaccompanied on international flights (4 or 5 hours the most though) for a vacation or long weekend with relatives. I've never heard of anything going wrong and in most cases the kids love the adventure.

It's something we'll start looking at soon for our eldest I guess.

[Kooky]

As a non-parent I'm always wary of giving opinions on this kind of thing, also as a cotton-wool kid who wishes her parents had been a bit more relaxed! Though (and I think I've told this story here before) I did come back from Sweden to the UK alone when I was 14, I was put on the ferry at one end and picked up at the other, and the worst I got up to was staying up all night drinking Bacardi and snogging a 17 year old boy

However I really can't imagine sending a child on a plane trip unless they had a dedicated minder the whole way. It was common many years ago I know, when expats sent their kids to boarding school back in civilisation, but that was then and this is now. Airports are huge and scary places. How does it work? Who takes them through all the officialdom, security, etc., that we have these days? What happens if they have a layover somewhere? (ref. Slinky's link) I would imagine the same level of service unaccompanied minors got years ago would cost a fortune these days - is it still available if you want it?

Hell, I'm worried enough about my promise to my uni-age niece that I'll buy her a ticket to Oz whenever she wants to come! (Though acknowledging she's never flown, her world is currently quite small, and she's not like your world-travelled expat kids.)

[baloo]

I was a recipient of an unaccompanied minor. They were taken from plane through immigration, baggage and customs by airline staff. When they exited, I had to hand over my passport and identification to the airline staff who checked against their copies and records before they would sign her over to me. In fact I couldn't even give her a hug until everything was double checked despite the child being really excited to see me.

[Kooky]

Hmm, wonder if anybody would provide a similar service for a blue-eyed willowy 20 year-old blonde?

[Pinklepurr]

Like I said, we have used unaccompanied minor travelling quite a few times, for both our kids and also for my niece for many years, she flew solo to and from NZ to Melbourne from the age of 8 or thereabouts. There is a lot of red tape to go through and only once did it seem to come unstuck, and that was only internal when they noticed that they didn't have anyone to accompany the child out through immigration and customs etc and so it took way longer whilst they organised it all, I have to admit to feeling a bit worried when all the other passengers seemed to have come out but not the one we were waiting for...especially when they usually come out with the first/bus passengers. Once Mr PP didn't have his ID with him, and boy did that create some hassles, but since the child was 14 at the time and could verify that it was indeed his dad who was there to pick him up they let it go through.

As for that willowy blonde K, hmmm, I am sure she would get lots of attention from at least some of the crew...

FB, I think the same, public transport can be extremely worrying, and in fact I was the victim of two different counts of "sexual assault" on public trains. However, if you are on a plane it is a little different, you can't get away and the trips are generally a lot longer and I imagine that a child could be very initimidated by someone and not know what to do in an instance like that.

[Lili Von Shtupp]

I'd be bummed out if I was asked to sit next to the kids.

I have some empathy with the policy, in their trying to manage risk. From customer service perspectice the handling at coal face of implementing was pretty disgusting, and don't blame these guys for feeling offended at all. Can you imagine minding your own business and then out of blue having people treat you like a pariah in front of all those other judging passengers, incredibly rude. The issue should have been managed long before anyone took their seat. That is plain incompetence.

Agree 100%. I think it's a risk management issue. Child gets up for some reason, plane hits turbulence, falls on male passenger, confusion ensues, accusations are made. Thing is, you never know what might happen, and unfortunately a man these days is guilty until proven innocent. To the men who are offended - rather than fight for the right to sit there without being judged, I think the sensible route is to just avoid that seat altogether. To the airlines - this policy can be presented as as protection for the male passenger as much as for the child.

[Fat Bob]

There are other options as to not having the man sit there.

Option 1: Ban unaccompanied children on all flights. No one under the age of 16 fly on their own.
Option 2: Ban all children on flights.

Simple.

[Lichtgestalt]

There are other options as to not having the man sit there.

Option 1: Ban unaccompanied children on all flights. No one under the age of 16 fly on their own.
Option 2: Ban all children on flights.

Simple.

I vote for option 2

[Scrummy Mummy]

There's always option 3 - ban all men!

[Lichtgestalt]

There's always option 3 - ban all men!

Who would fly the plane then

[Lili Von Shtupp]

There's always option 3 - ban all men!

I thought that was option 2.

[Pinklepurr]

There's always option 3 - ban all men!

I thought that was option 2.

[daffodil]

There's always option 3 - ban all men!

Who would fly the plane then

Naughty. But funny !

[Possum]

I was a recipient of an unaccompanied minor. They were taken from plane through immigration, baggage and customs by airline staff. When they exited, I had to hand over my passport and identification to the airline staff who checked against their copies and records before they would sign her over to me. In fact I couldn't even give her a hug until everything was double checked despite the child being really excited to see me.

Was that one of mine?