PRISM

Morrolan · Post by **Morrolan** » 7th Jun, '13, 12:57

only non-US persons outside the US targeted seriously? all of us?

this makes a joke out of every conspiracy theory ever invented. damn, Orwell was right.

Lili Von Shtupp · Post by **Lili Von Shtupp** » 7th Jun, '13, 17:02

This is on my To Do list: read up on all the surveillance allegations surrounding the president. I've been seeing so much hubbub but haven't had the time to actually read about it. But I do know that while conservatives are thumping their fists over this, some of my liberal friends have been asking "Where were you guys when Bush signed the Patriot Act after 9/11?"

slinky · Post by **slinky** » 7th Jun, '13, 18:12

The New York Times is saying the administration has 'lost all credibility' due to this issue. Those are strong words from a traditionally liberal leaning publication. Like Lili though, I haven't made time to read up on all of this to understand it fully.

T2K · Post by **T2K** » 7th Jun, '13, 19:31

"We" were as pissed about the Patriot Act under Bush as all this BS. "We" were also pissed about Bush's failure on immigration reform. But anyone who buys into the "us" and "them" the the R's and D's is asleep at the wheel. It's a wayang and it will get worse before it gets better, but the turnaround point will be dramatic and messy.

The illusion of "safety", or the false claim to it at least, seems to be the single biggest enemy of liberty today.

Morrolan · Post by **Morrolan** » 7th Jun, '13, 21:58

obviously this goes beyond any 'administration' or country. look around you. it's happening everywhere.

i'm not usually into conspiracies and 'they're taking our freedom' stuff, but this is getting absurd.

avatarless · Post by **avatarless** » 9th Jun, '13, 22:38

You've got to wonder how Google can so explicitly deny giving any sort of backdoor access to the government. Maybe one of the many companies that they bought was a front for (or at least highly infiltrated by) a spy agency?

baloo · Post by **baloo** » 10th Jun, '13, 11:27

Time to turn the Internet off. Who owns Compuserv these days ?

Spike · Post by **Spike** » 10th Jun, '13, 15:56

There has not been any kind of privacy for many years. Wherever you go with your mobile phone, you can be tracked - cell by cell, every transaction with your credit card is tracked and recorded, each time you use an ATM you are tracked and recorded, every time you use a loyalty card the transaction is tracked and recorded. All our emails pass through highly sophisticated filters in the intelligence departments of several countries, in the case of UK it's GCHQ. Privacy is an illusion and has been for a long time.

daffodil · Post by **daffodil** » 10th Jun, '13, 18:44

baloo wrote:Time to turn the Internet off. Who owns Compuserv these days ?

That would definitely be the end of the Forum!

I must be naive, admit to being a bit shocked at the alleged extent of the surveillance for sure.

slinky · Post by **slinky** » 10th Jun, '13, 22:23

Spike makes a good point -- pretty hard to be 'off the grid' these days, I would think.

avatarless · Post by **avatarless** » 10th Jun, '13, 23:20

Spike- for me this is not so much about privacy (although I do care about privacy) as it is about gov't abuse of power. I have yet to hear a US legal expert argue that the NSA data center being built in Utah is anything but illegal. I'm sure they're out there, but the consensus by and large is that it is illegal. The loss of the rule of law, w.r.t. the financial sector and now this, is an "existential threat to democracy" as what's-his-face said. Oh, well...

sluggo · Post by **sluggo** » 11th Jun, '13, 02:06

To add to what Spike said there are also cameras watching your every move in public and elsewhere especially in Singapore.

Lili Von Shtupp · Post by **Lili Von Shtupp** » 11th Jun, '13, 12:02

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/ju ... rveillance

About the whistleblower. Interesting read. I don't know if I would have chosen Hong Kong for a hideout, though. Apparently our friend Julian Assange is in contact with him. Perhaps the Ecuador Embassy in Hong Kong will have a new resident?

baloo · Post by **baloo** » 11th Jun, '13, 22:03

: cia.jpg (13.69 KiB) Viewed 7649 times

T2K · Post by **T2K** » 12th Jun, '13, 06:48

So, this guy Snowden is a high school drop out...and has top secret security clearance with the NSA? The other guy, Manning, only had secret clearance (as I once did also, which shows how easy that is to get!).

Manning's case was clear, he was under oath and on active duty. His court martial is clearly justified.
Snowden was working for Booze Allen Hamilton, to whom the NSA has apparently outsourced some part of his Prism program. I assume he must have been under some secrecy program with consequences, but am not sure.

I think our NSA looks like a bunch of buffoons here.

Morrolan · Post by **Morrolan** » 12th Jun, '13, 13:39

baloo wrote:Time to turn the Internet off. Who owns Compuserv these days ?

those were the days...

owned by AOL, by the way...

Duck · Post by **Duck** » 19th Jun, '13, 10:23

Let's not forget our travel cards... Oyster cards... EZ Link cards...
They track our movement too... Just sayin'

daffodil · Post by **daffodil** » 22nd Jun, '13, 09:43

So to the next expose...according to Snowden "They (GCHQ) are worse than the US"

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/jun/2 ... ations-nsa

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